My Project

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Re: My Project

Post  Therons on Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:06 pm

Beautiful! The height and distance is very impressive, any chance for a video?

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Re: My Project

Post  John on Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:34 pm

Hey! You are doing great! It does look very nice, and a very impressive arc!!!! I was looking at your top plate and I can't figure out what the purpose of the two screws that are threaded into it are for. Care you shed some light on it?
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Sat Aug 15, 2009 3:47 pm

Nothing now really - when I used silicone to seal in the plexiglass plate I put those two screws there to help lift out the top plate.
Now they are not needed.

This is pretty much a prototype project - will try whatever I can to improve and experiment so some different things may show up.
I plan to fine tune everything for the rest of this summer and into the fall and during the winter build 2 finished type fountians.

Thanks for your interest.

I hope to have the 3w RGB LED fiberoptic light source in this week.

Yeah video to come.

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Sat Aug 15, 2009 4:34 pm


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Re: My Project

Post  Magic-nozzle on Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:21 am

Hi covewi, nice Work, looksn close to perfect. Just a thought, if you are using a plexi plate at the end of the fibers, you loose a lot of the light, becaus refraction in the glass. A pro told me not to use a glass at the end, just use silicone to fit in. thats the way i do and i have pretty much light in there. What kind of fiber you plan to use? Important: try to mount the fiber direct on the LED tuching the little glass cover exact in the center and polish both the ends hi gloss! I cant wait to see yopur pictures or a movie testing it.

Cheers mairo
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Sun Aug 16, 2009 1:01 am

Great Idea about the light end. I will be using a lens holder like this - http://www.thecustomsabershop.com/Luxeon-IIIV-Lens-Holder--P7.aspx - over the 3W RGB LED.
Then this - http://www.thecustomsabershop.com/Luxeon-Collimator-Lens-10-deg-viewing-angle-P5.aspx - collimator lens to focus the LED light down to just 10 degrees.
I will place the end of the fibers right on the lens. I should get good light with the focused beam.
I will have a 1/2 (12mm) of fibers.
Hope it works should know by the weekend.

Mario - what kind of light (watts, led etc) do you use for your lighting system?

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Re: My Project

Post  Magic-nozzle on Sun Aug 16, 2009 1:20 am

Hi, Ok you are using fiber bundles of very fine fiber strands. How do you plan to use RGB?
I use 3mm coatet fibers and 1 fiber for each Led, R, G, and 2xB. because blue is the lowest brightness if you are using 3W luxeon Hi Powerleds like me. with my fibers i dont need a lens, because the 3mm fiber is exat fit on the LED point to pointm, that makes it so easy for the input.

cool the saber shop!, i build my own Turned laser saber (Another cool project) with this lens-holder, same 10 Deg. Lens an d a 5W Luxeon LED. Electronics and Effects selfmade.



Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

Good Luck with your LEDS, Plese send us some pictures with your testing.

Mario
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:06 pm

I turned up my swimming pool pump ( to see what kind of stream I could get) and I cracked the 1/4" plexiglass bottom plate.

Well I ordered 3/8" gray PVC sheets today. It is much stronger and easier to work with. I wont replace the top (nozzle) yet since it is working fine. I dont want
to spend any more time building - I want to watch the stream instead. Hope to be up and running by the weekend - maybe with the fiberoptics installed.

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Thu Aug 20, 2009 5:27 pm

I received my gray 3/8 inch (9.53 mm) thick PVC sheet today... Now this is strong looking... I made the following jig tonight to help cut the perfect circle.

http://videos.americanwoodworker.com/video/Make-a-great-circle-cutting-jig

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Sat Aug 22, 2009 12:24 pm

Now this is a nice circle - taking the time to use the correct tools and extras really makes a difference.



I finally figured out a way to feed the fiber optics into the bottom of the tube while still being able to remove the bottom plate and without silicone.





I am trying every little idea on this "test" tube and will build the finished products during the cold Chicago winters...

I am still waiting on my fiber optics guy to come through with the cable.

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Re: My Project

Post  Magic-nozzle on Sat Aug 22, 2009 11:51 pm

Wow, looks really nice, perfect circle. Do you use a rubber ring to make this thight at the outside? Because you said no silicone.
Cheers ...
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:54 am

Thanks - I put the o ring in for two reason - first like you said to ensure that there was no leak and second I needed the ring to take up some space to fully tighten down the threaded portion.

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:07 pm

Thought I would try a perforated alum sheet on top of the straw -

Going with my compression seal for the top and bottom plates I found a 3/16 inch thick O-ring which fits perfectly inside.

Just a close up.


Funny thing happened over the weekend -after messing around with the design - ( I took out the 1" open space above the filter) to save some space with my new 3/8 thick PVC top and bottom plates and I had the light tube within an inch of the brass nozzle - well the stream looked bad.

So tonight I went back to the original design that worked so well... we will see tomorrow - its dark here in Chicago

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Re: My Project

Post  Magic-nozzle on Tue Sep 01, 2009 4:18 am

Looks very nice your nozzle. Its funny, some little changes can mess up the whole stream ... Cant wait to see more ...
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Re: My Project

Post  John on Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:45 am

That's a great perforated aluminum sheet. Where did you get that? Did you make it?
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:31 pm

I am back






John - here's were I purchased the perforated sheet.
http://www.onlinemetals.com/merchant.cfm?id=1003&step=2&top_cat=60

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Re: My Project

Post  Jerry on Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:10 pm

Covewi,
Is the perforated metal actually touching or sitting on the top of the straws?

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:36 am

It is laying flat on top of the straws - but I think its causing some water interference - I would prefer to place it on the bottom right above the empty water chamber and under the filter material.

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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:24 pm

What is the optimal number of gallons per minute pump that should be used to produce the largest laminar stream?
Can a low pass filter decrease the output of the stream?
What size laminar stream are most of you obtaining ( height and distance)

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Re: My Project

Post  John on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:50 pm

Hey!

What is the optimal number of gallons per minute? In my opinion as much as possible before you nozzle blows up! You will probably reach a turbulent flow way before that.

Can a low pass filter decrease the output of the stream?

Yes. Anything will decrease the output of the stream. In fact so will everything else in the system. Every angle every turn, every length of tubing/piping, each layer will decrease the output of your stream. It is called head loss. There are ways to calculate the headloss of the tubing and everything, but it is complicated once you get to your nozzle since it has never been tested for it.

Suggestions as to how to get as much output from your pump.

Put everything inline and as close together as possible. Also use as large as piping as possible. Those are some of the ways to optimize your pump output.

When I first tested my system I used the smallest amount of piping possible, with my low pass filter, and I was able to get about 17ft by 3.5 feet high (5m x 1m high). That's a generous estimate since my nozzle wasn't flush with the ground, maybe subtract about 1 ft, so 16ft by 2.5ft (4.75m x .75m high). Currently I'm not getting that much because I changed the piping to be longer and smaller. I built a small water testing lab in my basement so I couldn't have the high output.


Last edited by John on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:54 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : correcting numerical values)
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:38 pm

Thanks - a lot of good info - I am currently getting a stream about 4'10" high and 12 in length - you can see what I am talking about in the photo labeled "I am back" above.

I am using a swimming pool pump and I just looked up the specs - with the pump 20 feet away it only outputs 110 GPM. That seems very low considering a OASE pump used by may laminar fountains output 1600 - 2000 GPM.

Does a higher GPM pump output the stream more efficiently? ie - less turbulence?

Next I run a ribbed hose from the pump to the low pass filter then 3-4 of smooth tubing to the laminar fountain. I am thinking of running PVC for everything next spring.

How do Wet Design get a laminar stream with this height?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdGICRO4it4

Heres an interesting chart from OASE
http://www.islandnet.com/~pondusa/57424-7.jpg


Last edited by covewi on Thu Sep 17, 2009 4:15 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: My Project

Post  Magic-nozzle on Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:58 pm

Hi
I just can talk about my experience. 2000 gal/hour is too strong! I usa a 5000 Lt per hour OASE Neptun (1300 gal/hour) and i just need 15% to 20% with a 1/2" outlet on a 8" Nozzle and a 6" Low pass. the best is when the pump is running as 100% or a little less i think. The turbulance will be removed by the Low pass and the foam in the nozzle. I tryed a lot and funny was if you change the length between the low pass and the nozzle, or between the pump and the low pass, i had a better or less better stream and less jitering up/down of the laminar stream.

I have no problem do a similar high and wide as Wet design looks like. Also i think John hav a perfect output and a perfect laminar in any high. If i build a new nozzle i will prefere a 10 inch tube. Or better use a plastic bucket with 15 inch that would be nice! The biger your nozzle the better everithing.

The chart oase link is not working? Can you correct it? Thank you.

This is just my thaughts, maybe others have different experience.
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Thu Sep 17, 2009 4:15 am

Try the link now - Thanks.

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Re: My Project

Post  John on Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:33 am

I'm still not sure the link is working (maybe it is just user error Very Happy )


I don't know what the maximum is on my nozzle right now. I haven't been able to test it to it's full capacity. Right now I am using 1100gal/hour (4100 liters/hour), and when I had the short tubing lengths (minimal losses) I was able to get the 17ft arc. It was still perfectly laminar and probably can get even further. However that testing will have to wait till I can get some larger pumps set up.

If you are getting 4'10" high and 12 in length then we are getting close to the same result.

Here is an idea. If you want to see how efficient your system is you can get a 5 gallon bucket (with lines) and time how long it takes to fill it up. Then you can compare that to your pump rating. Then you would know if there are significant changes you can make to your system, or if you just need to buy a larger pump.
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Re: My Project

Post  covewi on Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:57 pm

Received my plastic fiber optic cable today... its sweet... and its clear



There is a protective / reflective coating around the clear core



This is the light from a 1 W led shining though 12 feet of the 3mm cable... I cant wait to see a 3W led.



What should I cut it with?

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